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Latest Update6-25-02 - Ok, I admit it. I'm a little bored with the story and I only check in every week or two these days. 05-23-02 4-02-02 - The following new articles submitted to discussion board. Cheney ordered Flight 93 to be shot down at 9:55: Biggest piece of Flight 93 found in a pond 2,500 feet away (mistakenly reported as yards) (1/2 mile): Heaviest piece (in tact engine fan) of Flight 93 found 600 yards away: Pieces found everywhere up to 5 miles away, and fell on houses in Indian Lake like acorns: Willow Grove, PA's 111st Fighting Group has Cessna OA-37B Dragonflies (small armed jet) (photo): Toledo's 112th fighting squad's primary mission is to have combat ready F-16's capable of deploying in minimum response time: 3-25-02 FBI to allow families to hear the cockpit voice recorder. Flight attendant possibly stabbed as she fought back. (Finally! Still not nearly good enough for me... I want radar tracking, debris field map, Flight Data info etc.) 3-20-02 F-16 spotted leaving Toledo at 9am on 9-11-01 2-21-02 Correction of 1-31-02: Payne Stewart's Lear Jet was actually intercepted by an F-16 1 hour and 14 minutes after the last known transmission. It is unclear from the report at what time the request for an intercept was made, and how long it took from that time to get a fighter there. The time discrepancy comes from a time zone change in the report the original reporter I got the story from seemingly failed to notice. Thanks to an astute emailer for the correction. 2-13-02 Added a couple debris field photo links to secondary debris page. The first site shows the impact crater and debris spreading to the SouthWest. Secondary debris was found miles to the East, meaning nothing blasted their from the main site. 2-10-02 Here's a very interesting article on FAA reaction and intercept times.http://www.capecodonline.com/cctimes/archives/2001/sep/16/didhijackers16.htm 1-31-02 Remember Payne Stewart's Lear Jet? An F-16 got there within 21 minutes. What really happened 9-11? 01-20-02 What if it there was another way to take a jetliner down? We've been training to do that, but nobody is talking about it. This recent Slate article delves into 9-11, jet speeds, tactics and discrepancies... http://slate.msn.com//?id=2060825 1-06-01: Created new Forum at Delphi.com. I hope you all participate as before. Maybe Delphi will widen the audience for the debate a little. This site still is not easy to find in the search engines at all. 12-28-01: Server Crashed and went down for a few days. Sorry 'bout that. 12-21-01: The FBI has declined to release the Cockpit Voice Recorder to the families: http://europe.cnn.com/2001/US/12/21/inv.flight.93.tape/index.html 12-8-01: Added to Shoot Down Page: Comment: 2 Russian air to air missiles brought down a Korean 747 in 1983. That aircraft had cockpit voice recordings by the crew for two more minutes after the sound of the first explosion was heard. This verifies that a 747 (which is larger than Flight 93, a 757) would not be destroyed in the air when struck by a Russian air to air missile.http://aviation-safety.net/cvr/cvr_ke007.htm 11-29-01 - Altered summary: Relatives of the heroes on this flight should visit www.PlaneSafe.org 11-27-01 - Updated the heroes page to include info from the recent Newsweek exclusive. Important points are that: 11-24-01 - Added to White Jet page. Two other airplanes were flying near the hijacked United Airlines jet when it crashed in Somerset County, but neither had anything to do with the airliner's fate, the FBI said yesterday. In fact, one of the planes, a Fairchild Falcon 20 business jet, was directed to the crash site to help rescuers. The request for the jet to fly low and obtain the coordinates for the crash explains reports by people in the vicinity who said a white or silver jet flew by moments after the crash. A C-130 military cargo plane was also within 25 miles of the passenger jet when it crashed, FBI spokesman Bill Crowley said yesterday, but was not diverted. "There was a hole in the ground -- that was it," said Yates Caldwell, the pilot who was at the controls of the 10-passenger corporate jet for Greensboro, N.C.-based apparel maker VF Corp. "There was no way to know what it was .... I didn't know there had been a crash until I landed, until I was on the ground in Johnstown." Comment: There must be two jets... clearly this civilian pilot with EXECUTIVES ON BOARD was NOT at the controls of the aircraft that was witnessed tailing Flight 93 BEFORE the crash. That plane was at treetop level within a mile or so AT CRASH TIME according to 5 witnesses in separate interviews. I'm taking a wild guess here, but I think they would have known what that 500 foot fireball in the sky was all about before they landed. Another emaiI I received: All communications and radar are available at March Air Force base which directs all U.S. Customs jets in the entire United States. So they would have known both about Flight 93 and the location of their own assets, which are airborne a lot - or can be airborne in less than 15 minutes. Customs flies Cessna Citations, they are white and generally unmarked. They are also loaded with video equipment. They are not armed. They are flown by talented military pilots and can fly very low both fast and slow or very high and very fast. Their mission is recon. They sneak up on aircraft. It would have been rolling cameras and videotaped the shoot down if there was one. Nobody really oversees U.S. Customs. U.S. Customs has eleven AWACS. Each AWACS can scan the entire Western Hemisphere VERY quickly, very clandestine. http://www.customs.gov/ 11-21-01 - Added possible types of jets to mysterious white plane story. I'm working on a "Letters" page that samples what you guys are emailing me. 11-20-01 - Updated home page to reflect slower F-16 flying times. Still plenty of time to get there. Had an F-15 pilot write me saying he thought the situation would have been confusing and would have caused delays. He said he thought F-16 top speed was probably 700-800mph. In fact, top speed is reported at 1350 to 1500 many places on the Internet - but I heard with my own ears an F-16 trainer say 1800mph. These would be burst speeds and burn fuel very quickly. Pick your favorite speed. Flight 93 was converging at 500mph. In my mind, at 750mph at least one of the 3 F-16's should have gotten there. Someone else on the net argues our Air Defense basically must have sucked that day. They may have a point... or we might not have been told everything. Quick thanks to John and Ke KFI640AM in LA for having me on for about 1/2 hour today. 11/19/01 - Added mysterious white plane story not online anywhere else. Updated 757 info to indicate 757's DO NOT have any kind of flight physics computer to prevent overstressing when autopilot is turned off. This begs the question - would an Airbus, which does not allow pilots to overstress, have remained flying until it reached it's destination? 11/15/01 - Finally someone is asking around "I know of two people - I will not mention names - that heard a missile," Stuhl said. "They both live very close, within a couple of hundred yards. . .This one fellow's served in Vietnam and he says he's heard them, and he heard one that day." The mayor adds that based on what he knows about that morning, military F-16 fighter jets were "very, very close." 11/02/01 - Here's an article worth considering. It's a good thing the heroes were on the job because the National Guard is reported to have been flying circles over D.C. instead of intercepting a hijacked airliner with an unknown target.. 10/30/01 - Just a quick note to thank Pat Campbell from WSTV news-talk radio for having me on for an hour this morning. It takes some guts to bring up this topic and think it over on the air. 10/29/01 - Updated timeline with new information. 10/28/01 - Revised the summary a bit. 10/26/01 - updated some links that went bad. Hey people - if you need to see the original links you better save them now. We've had a number of articles disappear here. I also made small changes and additions to a few different pages to reflect new things I've learned. Nothing earth shattering. 10/24/01 - Added Sorensen's Article to links 10/23/01 - Added the Lear jet joke of a cover story to the Shoot Down page. Get the following videos before they are removed from the Internet. (they have all been removed from the internet as of about 1 month later. I did keep a copy on a MiniDV tape.) Video: A couple eyewitnesses talking about the plane going in and the primary debris field. Video: Governor says very little debris seen from air - just a crater. Video: Plane traveling SW at impact. Video: White mystery jet with no markings is strange to local news reporters. Video: Crash scene described, forest shown - 300 yards away is showered in small pieces. 10/22/01 - Found a spooky pdf link to an afternoon special edition of the Pittsburgh Post Gazzette on 9-11-01 -- 10:36 Flight 93 crashes? update - link added (10-21-01) Comment: If this 10:36 time is actually the correct time it really raises questions because all the cell calls ended before 10am. So did the Post Gazette call the locals and get an accurate time before they printed it as the headline on the front page? Or did they just make it up? Did someone report it to them wrong? I'm guessing it was a mistake. I also added a description of the primary debris field on the debris page that describes a unique area that is not part of an 8 mile continuous debris field. 10/20/01 - Google finally indexed this site - and it comes back on the first page of search results for "Flight 93" when I checked today. Guess, I can get off their case a little. I actually tried to buy a small ad on Google and they denied my ad because they didn't like the nature of this website - which is understandable. I imagine it will slowly show up on other search engines now. We'll see. 10/17/01 - The bulletin board was down for a few days, now it's working again. After about 10 days of not getting many emails etc. I've been getting a lot more in the past couple days. The counter shows about 1000 more page views in the past 24 hours, so somebody with a bit of traffic has linked here. I'm busy with work, but I hope to add some content and comments soon. I think I need to add a poll to this site - the emails I've gotten are all over the board. Very interesting reading. 10/06/01 - After talking to the real pilots of American and United Airline planes grounded that morning, FBI agents believe 12 separate incidents were planned. Investigators learned from the cockpit voice recorder from UA Flight 93, which crashed in rural Pennsylvania, that a hijacker had joined the flight crew. Comment: Wow, 12 incidents planned and we got 4 (four). That means 8 crews of terrorists may still be at large. Sleep tight. But again, do you hear it on the news? No, because you can't handle the truth. 10/03/01 - I've gotten a number of emails asking me to finish this darn thing off... really not that much to add. I just want to write up how a shoot down or bomb might have happened. 10/03/01 - Added to Military FAQ: In 1995, the CIA and the FBI learned that Osama bin Laden was planning to hijack U.S. airliners and use them as bombs to attack important targets in the U.S. This scheme was called Project Bojinka. Comment: Who's getting fired? Frankly, I beleive our military was aware of this threat and planned for it. The FAA is another story. Again, who's getting fired?? |